My Chat With The Creative Outfit
Disclaimer: I feel really bad about this, I conducted this interview a while ago, but a combination of a heavy work load and some personal issues with our unborn baby sidelined my blog. Patrick is a good guy, and I can only apologize for the delay.
But enough grovelling, on to the interview!
First question, can you tell me a little bit about who you are, and how you became a designer?
My route to the design world is a strange one and I'll try to convey the short version. I have a degree in Political Science from Saint Louis University and was enrolling in law school upon graduation. After I graduated, I realized that I didn't want to spend three years in a law library. While I was at SLU, I taught myself HTML and how to wrangle Photoshop as a hobby, which was a lot of fun. I decided to try my hand in the creative industry and got a job as an interactive designer. I worked for a year or so and realized how much I loved the work but also realized that I would benefit greatly from design school. I enrolled in Maryville University's Graphic Design program shortly after and got another bachelors degree in two years.
I took an internship at ProWolfe Partners after graduating and spent a few months soaking up everything I could, including as much of the business side as possible. Despite having limited experience, but being a born gambler, I decided to take a shot on my own.
I spent another year freelancing for a few agencies and picked up a couple of my own clients, gained some valuable experience, and met some great people who proved to be valuable resources.
How did you end up starting a design company?
When realized that I could design in all environments but couldn't program worth a damn. That's when I sought out my partner, Kent. The dude is a wizard and we compliment each other perfectly. Since we met and formed The Creative Outfit (TCO) we've gained a TON of momentum. I can speak confidently to prospective clients because I know I can give them great design and Kent can develop amazing user experiences.
Describe the other principals, Kent and Erin, and how they became part of The Creative Outfit.
The Creative Outfit is a triad of sorts. I do design, Kent does development, and Erin does strategy and copy writing. We came together more out of necessity than anything else. I never had a really profound vision about what TCO would be for me but I did respond to the needs of my immediate market. Specifically, I found that clients needed great strategic direction, effective copy, and awesome user experiences. I couldn't do all of that on my own.
Oh, and Erin is my little sister so I was throwing her a bone. Okay, that's not true. She has actually been helping me out of situations for a couple of years so it was only natural that she partner up with Kent and myself.
Do you have any other employees?
We don't have any full-time employees but work with a couple of contractors when the load gets too heavy, which is probably going to happen more and more this year.
You seem like a pretty young group. Does that give you any advantages or disadvantages when dealing with clients?
Definitely both. On one hand, I am still feeling out all the roles I have to play and trying to anticipate the needs and expectations of our clients. On the other hand, I can respond with a great deal of agility to those needs and expectations because we are still developing and refining our core processes.
Your leadership is evenly split between design, development and business strategy. How does that affect how you work, vs. other agencies that are more heavily weighted towards just one of those areas?
After speaking with a lot of my designer friends, I realized that a lot of places, at least it seemed this way from their accounts, were too focused on design, or too focused on development, and almost never focused on content. I believe that design best serves its masters when it helps to more effectively communicate the content; not serve as a vehicle that necessitates content. Strategy, and therefore content, should come first. Design and development then support that broader strategy.
Describe your work environment/office.
Right now? I'm in a Caribou Coffee in Midtown Atlanta. Kent is probably in his basement lair in South City. Erin is likely on the L in Chicago heading back to her apartment. I generally work from my condo in the Loop but we don't have an office space yet. That's our big goal for the end of 2009.
You might expect that to hinder our efforts, especially when wooing clients, but that hasn't been the case yet. I let my enthusiasm for a client's project give me all the credibility I need. If a client is put off by us not having an office space yet, that's okay with me. It probably wouldn't have been a good fit anyway.
What's your work schedule like? 9 to 5, 10 to 10, completely random?
I always tell people that I'm too young to be overworked. I truly believe that. While I always maintain a balance in my life, I'm basically on call for most of my clients. My day ends when the work is finished and no days are off limits.
If there's one thing I learned during my time in Ireland though it's that you should take off every beautiful afternoon and go outside. I'll get my work finished later. Besides, insomnia runs in my family and I live way too close to Forest Park.
St. Louis and the country are in a pretty serious recession, have you found it hard to land new clients and start a company?
I think the recession actually plays into our favor. We have such limited overhead and we're so young that we have to price ourselves very competitively anyway. With more companies looking harder and longer for value we are more likely to get the nod, or at least a serious look.
What sets you apart and gives you an advantage over other creative companies?
I think it's our balanced approach to design, development, and strategy. We're also very charismatic and engaging. Our clients really appreciate that. I also take every possible opportunity to find a way to say 'yes' to my clients, even if it requires rethinking the entire strategic approach or cutting a budget.
What are your biggest challenges as a company right now?
Positioning ourselves for growth. We desperately need to meet some talented, hard-working developers who might like to do some contract work for us. As we meet more people and get our name out there, we're getting a lot of attention. I can only hope the momentum continues and being prepared for growth remains our biggest challenge.
Does being located in St. Louis make it easier or harder to find and keep clients (or no different), and why?
That's a great question. I can't really answer beyond anecdote. On one hand, there are fewer potential clients than in a place like Chicago but there is also less competition. Ultimately, I love this city and think it deserves world-class design so I try my best to seek out and retain clients that appreciate our vision.
St. Louis has an issue with attracting/retaining creative talent, have you encountered this when hiring, and if so what did you do about it?
Since I'm still so close to Maryville and some of my old professors, I get to see the real deal talent coming up the ranks before they even hit the streets. I have a handful of names in my pocket when the time comes to hire some designers.
Do you have a particular type of client or industry you focus on?
We're doing several boutique e-commerce sites right now and I'd love to do more of those. From an intellectual standpoint, there is a lot to consider when designing and developing online stores.
Otherwise, I hope to get my hands on some non-profit projects so I can contribute great design to smaller non-profits that otherwise don't have a chance to get beautiful materials.
What size client do you normally deal with?
We've been handling a lot of small businesses so far but we're in the proposal process with a couple of pretty big companies that would likely lead to great long-term relationships and require a lot of hours.
Describe for me the process you use on a project. Do you use wireframes, mood boards, brainstorming sessions, discovery phases, etc.?
We meet with our clients first and I always ask the same question right away: What do you want this business to achieve? That questions goes a LONG way to identifying the appropriate approach to their project. More importantly, it answers whether or not the project even makes sense.
After thoroughly investigating objectives, Kent, Erin, and myself reconvene and think about the long-term impact of possible solutions, not only from a branding standpoint but also from a business standpoint. We then provide for the client a detailed report of our ideas, with the associated costs and components of each plan.
Once we decide on a direction, it's time to get down to work. Our process in that regard is pretty standard: design, refine, get approval, develop, test, etc.
We use wireframes for web projects that involve tons of information and sometimes I do mood boards for identity projects. As I said before though, we like to stay really agile and just react to the personality and needs of the client so we don't push these processes on them unless it makes sense.
What kind of software do you use (Adobe suite, Visual Studio, open source alternatives, etc.)?
I dream in Adobe, man. I readily admit my over-reliance on Photoshop but I have pretty good chops with InDesign after working for a shop that did almost all annual reports.
What platform do you build your websites on, LAMP, Java, .net, Cold Fusion, Flash?
Kent is a LAMP guy but he can work in a .net environment if he has to. We both try to avoid Flash unless it's absolutely necessary. Since it's not 2002 anymore, that hasn't been too much a problem. Speaking of Flash, we really, really love jQuery as a substitute for things that Flash would have been used for a few years ago. It's so light and easy and marries beautifully with CSS.
Do you use frameworks or CMSes in your web development, is so which ones and why?
Kent has developed a modular and extremely agile CMS that we use for all of our web projects. It's light weight and very easy to deploy. The CMS makes it easy for our clients, or us, to manage sites. As we come across new client needs, we devise new modules for the CMS and deploy them as necessary. It's been a great approach so far.
Before I met Kent, I was doing all of my development within Expression Engine, which is an awesome CMS. It's just a little more robust than necessary for the average site and eats up a lot of hours. Clients also forget how to make updates pretty quickly since the admin area is a little intimidating.
Hand code or Dreamweaver (or hand code in Dreamweaver)?
I hand code in Coda since I'm a Mac nerd and Kent hand codes in Dreamweaver. He wishes he could use Coda and he's jealous of my Mac.
(Kent's note: That claim is entirely false.)
Would you like to mention any other tools you use?
Graph paper and my trusty Pilot Precise V5 for sketching letters and logos.
I also dabble in FontLab but I'm a total novice and could really use some help with my metrics.
Pontificate for me for a minute on how the industry is changing, and where you think it's going.
For better or worse, it's going digital and, more specifically, mobile. At some point in the near future we'll all be even more connected to the internet than we already are. The iPhone has provided something of a blueprint for a platform that finally addresses connectivity, usability and beauty. Its success has already spawned copycats. Companies will realize that they need an effective mobile presence as they vie for the eyes and ears of potential consumers. Furthermore, the imminent death of printed newspapers is a harbinger for this change in my opinion.
Any big plans for The Creative Outfit and the future?
I want to own a warehouse like Rob Dyrdek and his Fantasy Factory, but mostly for the zip line. Having two bulldogs would be cool too.
Other than that, I want to see TCO continue to grow, continue to provide a great service to its clients, and also provide my family, Kent's family, and Erin's family with the means to live a balanced and fulfilled life.




































